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Andrew Cattermole 11-15-2005 06:59 PM

Yeah like I said your're just trying to sell something,Good luck with that.
I get my fruit and Veg from a Growers market,I'm not really worried about price comparsion for a powder as I enjoy eating/tasting food and cooking food.
Yep no doubt supplements have there place in high level competitive atheletism,something which I am not a part,as for appealing to Health, vitiality etc,
Thanks I'm doing petty well.

Ian Holmes 11-15-2005 08:14 PM

Thanks Ross. Glad to see that all that eating is paying off for something *grin*.

Taha Mohamedali 11-16-2005 02:20 PM

Eddie, Thank you for taking the time to respond thoroughly to my question. I don't feel like you were selling me something and I found the info very useful. The fact is that we can all find pros & cons for every way of eating / supplement / etc...... Consider how a newbie crossfitter who takes his/her daily Multi-vit feels when we tell them to pop 12 fish oil capsules because it will benefit them greatly....

I like the Black box approach and I plan to try juice plus in the coming future as I know I don't get good variety in terms of fruits and veggies, I eat what's convenient and what I like(pears, spinach, broccoli slaw, plums, oranges, tangerines, strawberries, blueberries) I'm sure there are phytonutrients that I'm missing out on.

Eddie (or anyone else who has used juice plus), did you stop your other multi-vit supplementation on starting juice plus? What benefits / changes should I look out for when I start to take it?



Edward D. Friedman 11-16-2005 06:48 PM

Brian: Skepticism is a great thing. It's protective. Good for you !

Re: Fiber, JP+ is formulated such that it retains fiber from the original constituent fruits, vegetables and gluten-free grains.
Re: Contents & size, if, G-d forbid, the water was removed from you and you were "powdered", how small a container would you fit in ? A soda can ? A pack of cigarettes maybe ? How tiny would an orange be if it was dehydrated and powdered ? Pretty small I'd bet.

Ryan - JP+ refers to it's distribution system as Virtual Franchising. Without being cute about labels, yes, it shares similarities with distribution systems variously referred to as MLM, Network Marketing, Direct Sales, etc. I'd bet you are way too smart to dismiss something only because of the distribution method. Are all retailers honest, or are they all dishonest? Is bartering always a bad idea, or always a good idea ? How about property sale/leasebacks ? I'm sure you'd agree that there are both deceitful and high integrity folks in every single, lawyer, indian chief, personal trainers and Virtual Franchisees. IMHO, big, big, mistake to confuse the messenger with the message.

As far as QuackWatch and Dr. Stephen Barrett, addressing where he's coming from is "beyond the scope" of this post. While I doubt you're that interested, JP+ has a position paper on Barrett, if you are interested e-mail me and I'll shoot you a copy. Let me say, that Dr. Barrett dismisses just about every approach to health that is not part of the medical/big pharma worlds. (eg; chiropractic, etc.) While that is his right, conspicuous by it's absence from his writings is anything addressing this:
or this:
I know, I know, drugs are sold retail with government regulation. Their sale couldn't possibly be wrongly motivated by profit. Moreover, the products couldn't possibly hurt anybody. Now, powdered fruits & vegetables in capsules - that's dangerous ! ( My obvious sarcasm is intended to be humorous, not offensive.)

I wish you well, and please do enjoy the Total Gym and HoHos.

Andrew, may you healthfully chomp & chew on F&Vs for a very, very, very long time. I see JP+ as an option for those not doing as well as you do and those who want to up their F&V intake, even from already high levels, easily.

Taha, I appreciate your open mindedness. Some people do report "improvements" of various sorts after eating JP+ for some time. The company does not endorse any such promotion. As I think I stated above, I myself did not experience any such "white light transformation". ( Although I have heard such accounts from long time personal friends.) I think it's because I already adhere to a good diet and have been blessed with overall good health. The idea behind JP+ is that it's "the next best thing" to F&Vs. Everyone has their own unique bio-chemical reaction to the introduction of increased F&Vs. However, if one accepts the science behind why F&Vs are good, and the science behind why JP+ is good, then the value is in knowing you are doing a good thing.

It reminds me of something like increasing water consumption. Some folks attribute miracles to this simple step. Some folks don't notice any difference in how they feel at all, they just do it because their conclusion after reviewing the level of evidence they are content with is that they believe it's good for them.

If your friend is not giving you the info you are looking for, you are welcome to e-mail me. I think it best not to clog up the CF board more than I already have. If I can help you, I'd be happy to. If you decide JP+ is for you, please do get it from your friend and just consider anything you get from communicating with me a "CF Courtesy".


Ian Holmes 11-16-2005 07:49 PM

So how do greens (the product) compare to JP+?

Edward D. Friedman 11-16-2005 08:08 PM

Don't know about Greens, it might be great.
JP+ has a substantial amount of peer reviewed professional journal published research on brand name JP+. In other words, the various studies were done utilizing that very specific product. If you like the results, you should like the product. I believe no other nutritional supplement, while some of them MAY be quite good, has the volume of quality research on that specific product.

Larry Lindenman 11-17-2005 06:12 AM

Once again I'll chime in with...stick with the basics and consistancy, before you start supplimenting. Before you buy Juice plus or any other "suppliment", look at what else your throwing in your mouth. Are you:

1. Eating 5 Zone balanced meals a day?
2. Taking a quality fish oil every day?
3. Drinking water as your main beverage?
4. Doing the WOD 3/1 consistantly?
5. Weighing and measuring food?
6. Enhancing recovery by resting, sleep, etc.

If your not doing the above've got some work to do prior to taking Juice plus or any other suppliment for that matter. I go to the the grocery on Sunday and pick out my fruit for the week. I go for variety and look for things I usually don't eat. I will usually have blueberries (frozen) or any frozen berries, mixed with oatmeal in my breakfast, an apple/orange/pear for lunch, strawberries/apple/pear/orange for snack and another piece of fruit for dinner...this is just following the Zone. If you "need" juice +, I'm betting your not on the Zone (unless your a small female), because I have to fill 5 blocks of carbs every meal. I need the carb dense fruit to meet my requirements. Juice plus is a shortcut (unproven IMO. Develop the discipline to eat your 5 Zone balanced meals a day and you WILL see performance and health benefits. There are no excuses for popping pills or powders over eating real food, just like there are no excuses for whimping out on your workouts.

Brad Hirakawa 11-17-2005 07:17 AM

Larry... I agree 100%.

Brian Hand 11-17-2005 01:19 PM

Okay let's think about it. According to the USDA, a 200g serving of apple (approximately one large apple) is 83.9 percent moisture and contains 26.6g of sugar. This leaves 5.6g of "other stuff" in one nice big apple. I don't know how big the capsules are but it seems you'd be hard pressed to fit the dessicated de-sugared remains of one nice big apple in your daily dose of juice plus.

Following the dollars it smells fishy too. I doubt that a company can dry, process, encapsulate, and deliver produce to me cheaper than the grocery store can deliver the same raw produce. If a product only costs $1.30 a day, there can't be that much raw materials (produce) going into it - $1.30 doesn't buy much produce!

James Falkner 11-17-2005 04:04 PM

Larry - isn't your #2 ("taking a fish oil every day") just another supplement? I wouldn't call that sticking with the basics. Eating fish for its healthy oils would be more along the lines of "basic" (assuming you think fish oil is beneficial).

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