CrossFit Discussion Board  

Go Back   CrossFit Discussion Board > CrossFit Forum > Exercises
CrossFit Home Forum Site Rules CrossFit FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Exercises Movements, technique & proper execution

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-06-2008, 05:34 PM   #1
Ben Bergeron
Affiliate Ben Bergeron is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Natick  MA
Posts: 115
To SDHP or not to SDHP?

The Sumo Deadlift High Pull is one of the 9 essential CrossFit movements, but should it be? There has been much debate about the compromised position of the shoulder at the top of the movement.

Tennis players and swimmers are very familiar with the injuries that pop up due to the impingement that happens when elevating the shoulder without external rotation (this is why overhead pressing is safe and upright rows are not).

I know Rippetoe doesn't like it, and many affiliates that have eliminated this move all together.

What is the consensus on the efficacy of the SDHP?
__________________
www.CrossFitNewEngland.com
Train Hard. Eat Clean. Live Life.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 09:38 PM   #2
Jared Ashley
Member Jared Ashley is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Tucson  AZ
Posts: 1,550
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

OK, I'm asking these as honest questions, not an attack:

Why is an SDHP bad for the shoulder, but a clean and it's variations are not? Or is the contention that those are also a bad idea?

And what exactly do you mean by elevating the shoulder without "external rotation"? I'm trying to picture what would be different if you elevated WITH external rotation, and it's not happening for me. I also don't understand why any of that is relevant to overhead pressing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 09:48 PM   #3
Donald Lee
Member Donald Lee is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Cypress  CA
Posts: 1,124
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_...row_052606&cr=

(wfs if you don't scroll down)

That's why the upright row is bad.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 10:00 PM   #4
Robert Callahan
Member Robert Callahan is offline
 
Robert Callahan's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Zzyzx  CA
Posts: 1,626
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

When done correctly the SDHP is not really a high pull at all. The explosive opening of the hips is what is supposed to impart momentum on the bar and carry it upwards. The arms will just bend to accommodate that vertical travel, they should not be actively pulling the bar up at all. Problem is while this is cool in theory it is very often not what happens in practice. A high pull is a very bad exercise and because of the confusion many beginners have with the SDHP vs a high pull Rip, and many affiliates do not use it. Whether that means CF shouldn't use it... well it is not up to me

-Robert
__________________
"I swear by my life and by my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine"
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 10:06 PM   #5
Júlíus Magnússon
Departed Júlíus Magnússon is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Oct 2007
 
Posts: 1,283
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Callahan View Post
When done correctly the SDHP is not really a high pull at all. The explosive opening of the hips is what is supposed to impart momentum on the bar and carry it upwards. The arms will just bend to accommodate that vertical travel, they should not be actively pulling the bar up at all. Problem is while this is cool in theory it is very often not what happens in practice. A high pull is a very bad exercise and because of the confusion many beginners have with the SDHP vs a high pull Rip, and many affiliates do not use it. Whether that means CF shouldn't use it... well it is not up to me

-Robert
I thought the arms were supposed to pull the bar up in the same fashion as in a push press; the main force is generated by the hips.

So the SDHP would be to the power clean what the push press is to the push jerk.

Does that make sense to anyone else?

I mean, if the arms have no say in the matter what so ever, why don't we just power clean instead of SDHP?
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 10:28 PM   #6
Matthew Vassallo
Banned Matthew Vassallo is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: New Tampa  FL
Posts: 215
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

i hate that exercise, and will do cleans, snatches, clean pulls, deadlift jump shrugs, basically anything i can possibly do to not do that exercise.

it really really bothers my shoulders.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 10:35 PM   #7
Stephen Flamm
Affiliate Stephen Flamm is offline
 
Stephen Flamm's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cincinnati  OH
Posts: 511
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

When performed correctly, it has a very high cycle rate - faster than a clean - which makes the SDLHP a brutal metcon movement. I think as an affiliate you will have to scale appropriately, and watch and correct form very closely and precisely.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2008, 11:56 PM   #8
Justin Gross
Member Justin Gross is offline
 
Justin Gross's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cardiff  CA
Posts: 237
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

By this logic, wouldn't the C2 rower be out? Honest question.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2008, 01:37 AM   #9
Blair Robert Lowe
Member Blair Robert Lowe is offline
 
Blair Robert Lowe's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sacramento  CA
Posts: 7,679
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

i'm gonna guess the load while rowing isn't that high even when it's set to max tension

so long as nobody gets crazy when pulling high loads on sdhp, even relatively for fitness level; most people should be fine. if it's supposed to be a metcon movement, load shouldn't be that high anyways
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2008, 10:29 AM   #10
Lee Austin
Member Lee Austin is offline
 
Lee Austin's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Austin  TX
Posts: 256
Re: To SDHP or not to SDHP?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Gross View Post
By this logic, wouldn't the C2 rower be out? Honest question.
You shouldn't be pulling the handle up to your neck; pull it into your body to either sports bra level or just above. It's a row, not a high pull.
__________________
F/41/5'6"/125 Workout Log, Fitday Log
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SDHP technique Tim Luby Exercises 8 03-02-2008 06:59 PM
SDHP issues Nicholas Daigle Exercises 9 11-14-2007 06:06 PM
SDHP Dominick Mattioni Exercises 3 03-29-2007 06:05 PM
SDHP Dan Colson Exercises 2 10-18-2006 04:48 PM
SDHP for back extensions? Troy Archie Exercises 7 12-31-2005 10:53 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
CrossFit is a registered trademark of CrossFit Inc.