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Old 01-16-2009, 10:23 AM   #21
Len Nuanez
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

This is one of those post that kind of divide a population, or maybe we military folk are just conditioned differently. I am kind of surprised that everybody is talkinga bout lawsuits and legal action when in my mind each and everyone of us is directly responsible for our own actions and the repercussions that come from them. I applaud you Josh in standing up and not pointing fingers. CF can be deceptively easy when you first start, I still have to remind myself that the WOD and some skill work is all I really need to do at my current fitness level, someday I will be a "firebreather" but I have to work to that. Unfortunately I can see our mutual employer using this as ammo against the entire CF community. Wasnt it in Oceana that they posted no WOD's are to be done in the base gym? Glad that you caught it early enough and got it taken care of, if youre ever in Washington hit me up for a workout.
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Old 01-16-2009, 01:13 PM   #22
Damon Stewart
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

George, while I agree that the affiliate should have given him the rhabdo warning your recommendation he go seek an attorney is troubling. Great advice
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Old 01-16-2009, 01:57 PM   #23
Steven Theisen
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by George Mounce View Post
I actually wouldn't blame you here. I would blame your CF gym for overdoing it with a new person, especially the jumping pull-ups. That is downright unsafe on their part and you could have, and probably should have sued the crap out of them for having you do that as a starting out workout.



That is bad on them again. They did 95lbs so you could get form down? Even the great Rip suggests if you can't do it with only the bar, you shouldn't be doing any weight. I have to question this CF gym a lot here...you would have thought after the last litigation fiasco they would have learned.




My jaw is dropping here after seeing this in your post. That gym is completely liable in this case, and you should seek a lawyer. That is unbelievably negligent on their part.



Go back? Seriously? You aught to go seek legal counsel, not go back to a gym that isn't fit to run its business.
Do people not like taking responsibility for there own actions. Instead of any lawsuit BS the OP should have been more responsibile and eased into working out. It's his own damn fault, the gym didn't give him rhabdo, he gave himself rhabdo. That's like saying McDonalds made someone fat, they made themeselves fat ********* people. Flamesuit on.

Last edited by Lynne Pitts : 01-16-2009 at 07:09 PM.
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:08 PM   #24
Pat McElhone
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

A few qucik thoughts on this...

First, is there a CrossFit Rhabdo database? Is anyone at CFHQ collecting actual data on rhabdo induced from CF? Tony B, Greg Glassman, any one from CFHQ reading this? This data base could be very useful information not just learn about rhabdo, what caused it, etc, but also to track actual cases of rhabdo.

Next, this will sting a lot of you, but to all the affiliates out there charging $100/hr (I have paid close to that for private training), are you really surprised people are talking about suing? Most affiliate charge between $80-100/hr for a private session. I am not debating whether or not a session is worth that, just that I do not understand how people can charge that much and not think they have a professional liability if what they "prescribe" actually hurts some one. That is on par with some doctors and dentists annual salary ($100/hr=$220k/yr). If a person followed the prescription from a Dentist/Physician/etc and got injured, would you still blame the person for not speaking up?
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:14 PM   #25
Gabriel desGarennes
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat McElhone View Post
If a person followed the prescription from a Dentist/Physician/etc and got injured, would you still blame the person for not speaking up?
The guy added quite a bit of work every night after the workouts at the gym. As a crossfit trainer i don't know what i'm not told. And if a client decided to do HOURS of extra work each night after my workouts and not tell, how the heck is that sue worthy?

I think the only thing the affiliate did wrong was not talk to the guy about rhabdo and maybe MAYBE they should have ratched the workouts down a bit. But without meeting this guy, and putting him through an assesment workout i cant really say much on if he was over worked AT the affiliate or at home.

The fact remains that BOTH people are at fault. Luckily the guy is level headed and realizes this.

As to your statement about a dentist...

If my dentist prescribed me a pro home whitening kit and told me to use it no more than once a day. And i used it 5 times a day and severely weakend my enamel.... You really think i'm sueing the doc? or kicking myself for being dumb...
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:15 PM   #26
Pat McElhone
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

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Originally Posted by Steven Theisen View Post
Do people not like taking responsibility for there own actions. Instead of any lawsuit BS the OP should have been more responsibile and eased into working out. It's his own damn fault, the gym didn't give him rhabdo, he gave himself rhabdo. That's like saying McDonalds made someone fat, they made themeselves fat ********** people. Flamesuit on.
Why do people go to CF coaches? Why do people pay others to coach them in CF? If you are going to a coach, you and the coach have a shared responsibilty. The moment the CrossFit affiliate accepted money, they enterred a relationship.

What was he prescribed? Was it in line with what other CF coaches would have prescribed? Neglence is not following the standard of care. If everyone reads this and thinks this affiliate over prescribed an exercise program. The guy followed it and got rhabdo, whose responsibilty is it?

Again, if you do not think this CF coach who prescribed this program was responsible, why pay someone to coach you?
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:21 PM   #27
Pat McElhone
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabriel desGarennes View Post

As to your statement about a dentist...

If my dentist prescribed me a pro home whitening kit and told me to use it no more than once a day. And i used it 5 times a day and severely weakend my enamel.... You really think i'm sueing the doc? or kicking myself for being dumb...
You might feel this way, but others might not and decide it is the dentist fault for giving you any whitener at all. Shouldn't the dentist (who is the expert on enamel, known you were predisposed to weakness? Next, an attorney may take this case too. So, the dentist would probably face a lawsuit and all the BS that goes with it. This is a tort case. You do not have to prove fault beyond a resonable doubt, just that what the dentist did probably caused the affects.
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:56 PM   #28
Gabriel desGarennes
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat McElhone View Post
You might feel this way, but others might not and decide it is the dentist fault for giving you any whitener at all. Shouldn't the dentist (who is the expert on enamel, known you were predisposed to weakness? Next, an attorney may take this case too. So, the dentist would probably face a lawsuit and all the BS that goes with it. This is a tort case. You do not have to prove fault beyond a resonable doubt, just that what the dentist did probably caused the affects.
I can't tell if you are agreeing or not. You call a possible lawsuit to the dentist BS and i'd agree. Attorneys will take all sorts of cases that aren't right, and win many of them. MY issue is with people telling the guy to sue when he has a seemingly level head about the situation and is accepting his portion of the responsibility.

Could the affiliate have warned him about rhadbo, DEFINITELY.

Did their workouts give him Rhabdo. Maybe, they definitely should have quizzed him more about other activities and how he was feeling after the prior workouts. Coffee colored **** is a no brainer.

the bottom line is i'm glad he is alright, i'm glad he isnt suing and i think its silly for anyone to try and convince him to do so.
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Old 01-16-2009, 03:05 PM   #29
Sean Dunston
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat McElhone View Post
You might feel this way, but others might not and decide it is the dentist fault for giving you any whitener at all. Shouldn't the dentist (who is the expert on enamel, known you were predisposed to weakness? Next, an attorney may take this case too. So, the dentist would probably face a lawsuit and all the BS that goes with it. This is a tort case. You do not have to prove fault beyond a resonable doubt, just that what the dentist did probably caused the affects.
Hold on a second...
I was able to keep silent on this for a while, but the past couple statements you made are only partially true. Yes, there are eggshell plaintiffs out there, but you are missing a BIG issue in the defense of a negligence claim.

If a person is in a contributory negligence jurisdiction, and the jury finds that the person's own negligence contributed to his injury, then that may totally BAR his recovery.

I am not picking sides one way or another on Mr. Sisson's Rhabdo. I am bummed for him because I understand Rhabdo to be painful, but as I noted in my post on the first page of this thread, I see that he himself acknowledges he let his own ego get in his way.

I just want to clarify something here so that people get a better understanding the law in this matter.

FWIW - I am a Virginia licensed attorney. The Commonwealth has kept the common law rule that a Plaintiff's contributory negligence is a COMPLETE BAR to his recovery.

I AM NOT GIVING ANY LEGAL ADVICE ON THIS ISSUE - AND NONE OF YOU ARE MY CLIENTS.
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Last edited by Sean Dunston : 01-16-2009 at 03:08 PM. Reason: corrected spelling errors
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Old 01-16-2009, 03:07 PM   #30
Pat McElhone
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Re: 1st post, 1st time rhabdo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabriel desGarennes View Post
I can't tell if you are agreeing or not. You call a possible lawsuit to the dentist BS and i'd agree. Attorneys will take all sorts of cases that aren't right, and win many of them. MY issue is with people telling the guy to sue when he has a seemingly level head about the situation and is accepting his portion of the responsibility.

Could the affiliate have warned him about rhadbo, DEFINITELY.

Did their workouts give him Rhabdo. Maybe, they definitely should have quizzed him more about other activities and how he was feeling after the prior workouts. Coffee colored **** is a no brainer.

the bottom line is i'm glad he is alright, i'm glad he isnt suing and i think its silly for anyone to try and convince him to do so.
Personally, I am glad Josh is all right and I think his outlook is a beathe of fresh air. I am all for taking personal responsibilty. My point is that what was the responsibility of the affiliate/trainer? IMO, the trainer was neglegent based on reading the information posted. I view the trainer as the subject matter expert. They "prescribed" the workout and should have assessed for after effect. They should have told him no additional activity in the "ramp up phase" or at least asked him when he came back if he did anything extra. I do not think they did.

Going to an affiliate is expensive. I am not saying it is not worth it. I do not understand how people (affiliates reading this post) can expect to be paid equivalent to >$200k a year and not expect to be sued when someone follows their "prescription" and gets injured. Everyone here (CF) talks of the "prescription" for training. In this case the prescribed dosage was a lethal dose. How prescribed the dosage? Who was the one who prescribed the dosage not responsible? At the least, they should have assessed (asked) if he did any additional work and adjusted the next "dosage" based on what was assessed.

I am not an affiliate, but I have friends that are and support them. Again, I am glad Josh is all right and I appreciate his outlook here.

Last edited by Pat McElhone : 01-16-2009 at 03:10 PM.
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