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Workout of the Day Questions & performance regarding CrossFit's WOD

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Old 01-27-2006, 09:01 PM   #21
Kalen Meine
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Ah geez. People, the world is bigger than CF. Are we really so defensive that when a guy shows up who is obviously walking the walk, and then decides to do an example of our stuff (and no fair splitting "our stuff" into "closer to his stuff" and otherwise- it's one of the select benchmark workouts, for chrissake) that we have to strut about similar times, or the stuff he can't do? The man is apparently a beast in more ways than one. This kind of elitism is just what has been causing crap lately. A superb coach got grilled for not patroling a message board in the middle of cyberspace nowhere. We've brewed crap for years with DD and kettlebellers in general over whose chunk of iron is best, when we share implements and ideas! GAHHH! Ours is not the best! It may be closest, but it's not perfect. It's a work in progress, and it always will be, and ensuring that progress is made necessitates experimentation, inclusion of those who are similarly "badass," and an understanding of the capabilities of others. We need friends with similar goals- they don't need all of them, especially if those distract from a short-term goal. Check out the friends of CF on the front page if you need a reminder.

Look at what can be learned from this- a guy with reasonable Linda times, but no training, and is way, way stronger. Is this a sign we can add more strength work without losing our metcon edge? Is this further sign the ME black box is on the right track? Not far enough? This kinda stuff is data, not a challenge to our honor.

I realize this is a hateful post, and for that I'm sorry. It just seems to me we've been ****ing people off left and right who ought to be our friends, and if you correctly correctize us as a collection of ideas and examples of their implementation, and not a cult ala HIT Jedis, then we need to make room for people whose goals differ by degree and ratio, but not kind.
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Old 01-27-2006, 09:10 PM   #22
Lynne Pitts
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All righty, boys and girls.
We are NOT re-engaging on the "superb coach" nor are we going to degenerate into a T-nation-esque chest thumping war.

While that may have been the intent of posting this episode in the first place, this isn't the board for it. There are plenty of other places to engage in acrimonious debate for the sheer (incomprehensible) entertainment of it.

We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.
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Old 01-27-2006, 09:27 PM   #23
Craig Van De Walker
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I think it is quite impressive. I would bet his performance is high in the top 99th percentile of powerlifters, as well as crossfitters (for that workout and possibly others).

I don't worship it, but I can appreciate and applaud it, just as I can appreciate Matt G., Eva T., Cisco, Greg, Dan John or Coach Glassman smoking me, in many different things. I think we should be able to admire without (too much) jealousy those with impressive abilities, even if the complete package does not meet what we would have for ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I can't always do it myself but I try, sometimes I have to try really hard.
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Old 01-27-2006, 10:09 PM   #24
Eric Moffit
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pretty good points, Kalen. i guess my main problem was the spirit in which it was posted and that determined the form in which i responded. basically, there is no way im going to congratulate anyone who flicks the camera off at the start of the performance. bad form.

i do like your comment about the ME Black Box. perhaps we arent going far enough with it. recently ive started to think of the lower weight/higher rep stuff as expressions or 'tests' of fitness, whereas the ME stuff is what really builds us up...but then theres that whole power output/intensity thing that seems pretty effective...hmmm
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Old 01-28-2006, 08:59 AM   #25
Larry Lindenman
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People, crossfit is not about specialization...pushing it in one direction, say strength, detracts from other directions. If strength is your thing...by all means go for it. Remember when grappling became the only way to win a full contact MA fight. Why was that, because no one grappled...they didn't know how to deal with it, it was new. What happened, Gracie made a lot of money, everyone grappled, and stand up fighters began to learn how to deal with grapplers. We go off on a chase for strength, metcon suffers. By all means, if strength is your thing, go for it! Just don't read too much into it. Everyone take a deep breath and re-read "What is Fitness?"
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Old 01-28-2006, 09:03 AM   #26
Tony Young
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"... the point was not that Crossfit workouts aren't impressive tests of this and that, but rather that CF isn't a be all and end all means of achieving good fitness levels."

Sorry, Kev but you still can't say that yet.

Let's not forget that CF is a total fitness protocol; all 10 aspects of fitness, one of which is strength. There are 9 others. I'm impressed
with your performance. Kudos. You're probably overall very fit which is not even your focus, not at the moment, anyway. But one workout is not a test (or, for that matter, an endorsement) of a system this complex. If you find a better workout that provides what CF does, let us know.

"I just got reall ****ed of at "caoch" over the Dan John bit, and said some nasty things about him at the P&B. I figured that I shouldn't be talking that kind of smack about somebody unless I could at least do well at some of the stuff that they do,..."

And if you think doing a single workout justifies bad behavior you're wrong again. If you've a problem with the way Greg and Dan do business, fine, comment on that. But let's not have "See, I can do one, now I can say anything I want". I don't know what you said on the P&B board but to comment on their latest disagreement didn't require an in depth knowledge of any workout scheme. It had to do with loyalty, trust, priorities, conflicts of interest - real and perceived, timing, integrity, friendship and more. It had little, if anything, to do with the merits of any particular training regimen. To reduce it to "the Dan John bit" is to remove the core of a complex discussion. To try to use a good performance on one workout to legitimize your comments misses the point entirely.

Not everything can be reduced to the flip of a finger, a single workout or a 3 lift total.


(Message edited by tyoung6 on January 28, 2006)
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Old 01-28-2006, 10:41 AM   #27
Kevin C. McCloskey
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Alright.

Took two days, but here I am. Frankly, discussion has pretty much come and gone, but I went to the trouble of registering, so I might as well show.

First, there's not any complex motivation or "message sending" involved in this. I was fired up about something, and decided to turn it into a challenge. I wasn't trying to "justify" any "bad behavior." I was just blowing off some steam and trying to take on a challenge, instead of being an armchair quarterback. I didn't ask Steve to copy the workout here, nor did I intend or expect him to do so. I had a hunch he might, and am sort of glad he did, but didn't really care one way or another. Problem is, once he did that, without me having an account here, I've been only able to give an occasional semi responsive monologue,as opposed to engaging in an active dialogue. There's actually two threads over here talking about this stuff, this one and one on the "community" board, both of which make a little more sense in conjunction with the other.

I've got a workout to do now, but in the spirit of discussion, I'll be back later to actually talk about the workout in its own right, if anyone cares to hear a powerlifter's take on it.
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Old 01-28-2006, 10:51 AM   #28
Lincoln Brigham
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Sure thing, Kev. As Tony said, if someone is getting better results we want to know about it and steal liberally!

I, for one, want to know what % of your workouts are GPP type of exercises, how hard you go during them, and how short your rest intervals during your powerlifting workouts.
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Old 01-28-2006, 10:59 AM   #29
Russ Greene
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It's cool to compare yourself to specialists b/c it shows you how embarrasingly little you've actually accomplished in that discipline. Next time I'm deadlifting and squatting (tomorrow) I'll think of Kevin.
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Old 01-28-2006, 01:23 PM   #30
Rob McBee
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This feels like another 'thing' to get drawn into instead of comparison of data/results. Damn strong performance by any standard. I have no problem recognizing that and would be interested in talking and possibly learning more training methodology.



(Message edited by Rob_M on January 28, 2006)
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