CrossFit Discussion Board  

Go Back   CrossFit Discussion Board > CrossFit Forum > Fitness
CrossFit Home Forum Site Rules CrossFit FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Fitness Theory and Practice. CrossFit's rationale & foundations. Who is fit? What is fitness?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-10-2011, 11:59 AM   #101
adam adkins
Member adam adkins is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lexington  KY
Posts: 761
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Struan Potter View Post
What does that mean?
Yeah that is exactly what I am saying. It doesn't "mean" anything.

If you are defining crossfit mainpage then these guys aren't doing crossfit. But if you look at what affiliates are doing and calling what they are doing crossfit too, then the programs I posted could fairly be labeled as crossfit. That's not because crossfit is changing the way athletes train. It is because many affiliates are taking the way athletes have always trained and repackaging it as "Crossfit."

By that definition, the video I posted is "crossfit with a strength bias." Go watch what Ethan Reeve does at wake forest. That is crossfit with a strength bias. Go watch watch Mike Barwis did at michigan. That's crossfit with a strength bias. Go watch what Bennie Willy did at tennessee and what I assume he is doing at texas. That's crossfit with a strength bias.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 12:01 PM   #102
adam adkins
Member adam adkins is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lexington  KY
Posts: 761
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Struan Potter View Post
So a decent football player should be able to play basketball to a good standard then?
No not at all and perhaps you should go back and read the thread before commenting.

I am saying the program used by each athlete to maximize genetic potential in strength and power should be virtually identical with any deviation stemming from individual differences rather than sport selection.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 12:04 PM   #103
Mauricio Leal
Affiliate Mauricio Leal is offline
 
Mauricio Leal's Avatar
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Oakland  CA
Posts: 839
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by adam adkins View Post
I am saying the program used by each athlete to maximize genetic potential in strength and power should be virtually identical with any deviation stemming from individual differences rather than sport selection.
You, good sir, are blasphemous. I like it. Also, I hope you have a lot of time to kill today.
__________________
CrossFit Cypher
www.crossfitcypher.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 12:09 PM   #104
Mark Boyle
Member Mark Boyle is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Toronto  ON Canada
Posts: 126
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by adam adkins View Post
Both pepper and curry are prime examples (on the same teams). Might as well add in Joe Mauer and bo jackson and dion sanders and ...... They are all elite athletes in at least two sports (mauer elite at everything he did). If the training requirement were as different as you suggest and the training starkly different, being a two sport star (let alone what mauer did) would be impossible.

It is ridiculous to assume that these guys had a separate training program for each sport and was able to implement it in time for each season. Instead, what is clear is that these guys had a single program (and an f-ton of god given talent) that benefited them in a multitude of sports. And that is because the programs that will benefit each of these sports is substantially similar.
You just don't get it do you. Just because an athlete can play two sports doesn't mean that the *optimal* training for each is identical. The athletes in question (who all eventually switched to a single sport in order to concentrate on it except for Bo who got hurt) would obviously make some compromises in their physical preperation.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 12:11 PM   #105
Mark Boyle
Member Mark Boyle is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Toronto  ON Canada
Posts: 126
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by adam adkins View Post
No not at all and perhaps you should go back and read the thread before commenting.

I am saying the program used by each athlete to maximize genetic potential in strength and power should be virtually identical with any deviation stemming from individual differences rather than sport selection.
Let me know when you figure out that there is more than just maximizing strength and power involved strength and conditioning for sport.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 12:13 PM   #106
Mark Boyle
Member Mark Boyle is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Toronto  ON Canada
Posts: 126
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Struan Potter View Post
That shouldn't even be debated. Elite athletes in professional sports need specific training. How is doing Fran specific to football?
Exactly!
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 01:41 PM   #107
Katherine Derbyshire
Member Katherine Derbyshire is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Seattle  WA
Posts: 7,596
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by adam adkins View Post
No not at all and perhaps you should go back and read the thread before commenting.

I am saying the program used by each athlete to maximize genetic potential in strength and power should be virtually identical with any deviation stemming from individual differences rather than sport selection.
Several problems with this. First, we have to ask why a baseball player would even want to "maximize genetic potential in strength and power," given the sport specific demands of baseball.

But the more important question is how do you define "virtually identical?" if exercise selection, volume, and intensity are all different, can you really say that two programs are the same? My house cat is "virtually identical" to a tiger, too: yeah, he's much smaller and less ferocious, and has never hunted live prey in his life, but he's got claws and teeth in all the right places!

Katherine
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 01:47 PM   #108
adam adkins
Member adam adkins is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lexington  KY
Posts: 761
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
Several problems with this. First, we have to ask why a baseball player would even want to "maximize genetic potential in strength and power," given the sport specific demands of baseball.

http://articles.elitefts.com/article...trong-as-hell/ wfs

Good article from underground strength on why baseball players should be strong. And for the record, I would be fine with the program Meglio outlines for football and basketball too.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 01:50 PM   #109
Eric A. Brown
Member Eric A. Brown is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: New York  NY
Posts: 226
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by adam adkins View Post
That's not really what I am debating. The issue I am debating is whether sport specific training is so specific that is has no application to other sports.

This is not what you said earlier in the thread.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2011, 02:06 PM   #110
adam adkins
Member adam adkins is offline
 
Profile:
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Lexington  KY
Posts: 761
Re: Defranco on Crossfit for Athletes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katherine Derbyshire View Post
But the more important question is how do you define "virtually identical?" if exercise selection, volume, and intensity are all different, can you really say that two programs are the same? My house cat is "virtually identical" to a tiger, too: yeah, he's much smaller and less ferocious, and has never hunted live prey in his life, but he's got claws and teeth in all the right places!

Katherine
Things start to get confused when we talk in analogies. What is the behavior of a tiger to a house cat? what about a feral cat? How about a lion to a tiger? Wait, is basketball the lion or the tiger? How about a puma or a cheetah?

The idea that sport specific training is not all that specific is not a new one. Mike Boyle - I am assuming no relation to the poster given the discrepancy of opinion - wrote about it years ago (at least 3 yrs ago). Whatever you think of Mike you can't deny he has trained a ton of athletes. And he agrees with me (or I agree with him, whatever).

There is no question that everyone likes to think that training is this extraordinarily complicated puzzle to which only a select few know the keys to solving. But its not. That fact is that nobody has any idea how to make a better football player. Heck, Dan John does an entire seminar on how there is just no way to tell what makes a better athlete.

Take the Knowshon Moreno thread. If KM comes out and puts up 1800yds can we assume CF training did the trick. Or did his line get better, or did his understanding of the offense get better, or did QB and WR play get better so it opened up the running game, or did one million other factors contribute?

All you can do for an athlete is make them strong, correct the movement patterns, and address their weakness. And I am saying the methods of doing that are virtually identical for all mainstream athletes.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How many athletes or former athletes follow CF? What was your sport, level of competition, and why did you begin CF? Ben Jackson Fitness 23 03-08-2012 02:54 PM
CrossFit for athletes? Tim Dexter Community 5 05-17-2011 06:46 AM
Power athletes are more insulin resistant than endurance athletes Neal Winkler Fitness 46 03-01-2006 04:36 PM
Crossfit for athletes? chris anderson Starting 9 03-21-2005 12:49 PM
British Crossfit Athletes AARON FISHER Community 14 12-12-2004 01:58 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:32 PM.


CrossFit is a registered trademark of CrossFit Inc.