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Old 12-30-2010, 10:03 AM   #1
Yahya Kohgadai
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programming questions (strength)

So how would you decide when to chose say, 5x5 over 5/5/5/5/5?

And just to get a rough idea on where to start, what percentage of the trainee's 1rm would you chose for 5x5
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:12 AM   #2
Eric Montgomery
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Re: programming questions (strength)

A 5x5 or 3x5 can be adjusted incrementally much easier than a 5-5-5-5-5. Much easier to track progress than if you're jumping all over the place.

It'll vary from person to person but I'd say a good 5x5 starting point would be 70-75% of 1RM so they've gor some room to make gains before things start getting difficult.

Last edited by Eric Montgomery : 12-30-2010 at 10:15 AM.
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:14 AM   #3
Renee Lee
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Re: programming questions (strength)

what are your goals and what is your long term strength programming looking like?

if you're following a template that does sets across, stick with sets across. if you're following a template that does ascending sets, stick with ascending sets. Don't mix them together all willy nilly with no long term plan just because you want "constant variation."

If you're following a SS like template, the first session take an empty bar and do 5 reps. add weight and do another 5 reps. rinse and repeat UNTIL THE BAR SLOWS. then do 2 more sets.

this is pretty much verbatim out of the book. you should read it
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Old 12-30-2010, 12:06 PM   #4
Randy Tarasevich
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Re: programming questions (strength)

75-80%.
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:08 PM   #5
Yahya Kohgadai
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Re: programming questions (strength)

actually, what I meant was not a 5x5 strength program but more like.......

let's say I'm doing a CFSB type of programming out of my box and I decide to do something like:

Mon: Press, met-con
Tues: Squat, met-con
Wed: strength off, long met-con
Thurs: deadlift, met-con
Friday:heavy met-con
Saturday: Bench, met-con

So I figure for say, Press, I can do 3/3/3/3/3 one week, then 1/1/1/1/1 etc, the next week and then maybe 5/5/5 the next one.

When and why would I do the same weight straight through like 5x5 or 3x3 as opposed to 5/5/5/5/5 or 3/3/3/..

I think I worded my question totally wrong..
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:14 PM   #6
Renee Lee
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Re: programming questions (strength)

what is the majority of your population? novices or intermediates? That will give you your answer.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:43 PM   #7
Yahya Kohgadai
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Re: programming questions (strength)

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Originally Posted by Renee Lee View Post
what is the majority of your population? novices or intermediates? That will give you your answer.
hmmm, well I'm not programming for a specific box just yet but what would you have in mind for each? What about for a even mix of both?
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Old 12-31-2010, 12:50 PM   #8
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Re: programming questions (strength)

I would agree that a 5x5 (with timed intervals of rest) Is much easier to chart progress than un-timed rest. You would use the same weight for your working sets. 5/5/5/5/5 Would allow you to use wave loading of weight and potentially throw some extra heavy weight at the end (you could also time the rest). IMO they are equally effective in eliciting a serious strength response, however you need to go HEAVY (relative to your abilities but heavy all the same). A better plan might be 3x3 one upper, one lower / 5x5 one upper, one lower switch each week. Just my .02
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Old 01-02-2011, 02:16 PM   #9
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Re: programming questions (strength)

Just so I'm clear on this discussion:

5x5 would be 5 sets of 5 reps with constant weight (timed, untimed rest, or in a Met-con)?

5-5-5-5-5 would be 5 set of 5 reps with increasing weight?

I like this chart:

Question: What is the correct number of REPS per SET.

REPS per SET FOR WHAT ACTIVITY
3 or less, Fast explosive sports - Weightlifting
5 reps, Other Power athletes - Sprinters
5 - 8 reps, Strength training for majority of sports people
10 - 15 reps, Strength training for athletes requiring endurance
above 15 reps, For endurance

(from http://www.qwa.org/articles/tmethod.asp , Training Methodology by Leo Isaac)

The rest of the article covers volume, intensity, training load. I recommend you read it and you may have a clearer idea of how to obtain the results you are looking for, dependent on specific athletes needs and desires.

True weak novices needs the 5-8 rep sets (3x8 @ 70 to 80%). Intermediates and up need the 1, 3, or 5 rep sets heavy (80 to 100%).

The only place I would hold weight constant is in a met-con (or if form suffers, then I would actually drop weight until good form is returned; dead lift being the classic example). If you think about Fran with 21-15-9 it falls in the endurance category, which I certainly find true. The weight is not the issue, it is the speed and reps that get you.

If it is lifting for strength and power then weights should be increasing between sets.
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:04 PM   #10
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Re: programming questions (strength)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahya Kohgadai View Post
actually, what I meant was not a 5x5 strength program but more like.......

let's say I'm doing a CFSB type of programming out of my box and I decide to do something like:

Mon: Press, met-con
Tues: Squat, met-con
Wed: strength off, long met-con
Thurs: deadlift, met-con
Friday:heavy met-con
Saturday: Bench, met-con

So I figure for say, Press, I can do 3/3/3/3/3 one week, then 1/1/1/1/1 etc, the next week and then maybe 5/5/5 the next one.

When and why would I do the same weight straight through like 5x5 or 3x3 as opposed to 5/5/5/5/5 or 3/3/3/..

I think I worded my question totally wrong..
This (sets across vs. ascending sets; and reps/set for strength) is a fairly big question with a large degree of disagreement/controversy (ie. what is better for pure strength vs. strength endurance, etc). Rip likes 5s (which some say is the realm of strength endurance), Westside does heavy singles on ME day, Wendler has something in between.

I think the CFSB article (I don't have it in front of me) has a discussion of their (Martin and Bingo) philosophy. If I recall correctly, its about a wave-progression using ascending sets (ie. try a heavier weight with triples then try it for 5s, then test your 1RM every once in a while).

Last edited by Rene Forestier : 01-02-2011 at 06:07 PM.
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