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Old 09-13-2011, 07:43 AM   #21
Robert Fabsik
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Re: The 405 Squat

Frances-
From a strength training perspective the most important or unifying idea is to include squatting in your training with proper form. Deciding to LBBS or HBBS probably depends on your goals. The more focused and the more elite one becomes then the differences between them become more and more important. If you want to squat the biggest weight ever most people who have squatted huge weights LBBS. If you want huge quads HBBS is usually a better choice for most. But, both are good exercises.

Also as you noted, based on how you program might make one squat more essential than the other. If you are deadlifting on a regular basis and doing a lot of posterior chain work then maybe the HBBS might be adequate depending on your strengths, weaknesses and body type. But if you are doing only Oly lifts compared to some of the big powerlifters your posterior chain might not match up to their standards. Or if you are doing an abbreviated program either on its own or in a program that blends in metcons where you do 1-2 strength movements per session, you might want an exercise that gives you more bang for your buck like LBBS.

Oly lifters are known for their quad development which they hammer with HBBS, front squats and the oly movements which really hit the front of the leg and to some extent the back of the leg. A lot of powerlifters would argue that oly training neglects the posterior chain, but for the elite oly lifters they can compensate with all of their anterior leg strength most of the time.

I'm a bigger fan of the LBBS, but I think what is most important is to squat.
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Old 09-13-2011, 11:29 AM   #22
Aaron Gainer
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Re: The 405 Squat

I wouldn't even worry about the posterior chain if your doing any type of clean or snatch related movement to being with. They use plenty of your posterior chain if you do them correctly!!!
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Old 09-15-2011, 08:47 PM   #23
Matt Haxmeier
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Re: The 405 Squat

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Originally Posted by Matthew Swartz View Post
As for my spooner, I always squat better with the treat of forcible sex looming behind me.
I assume you meant Threat, but it's probably even better this way. lol.
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Old 09-16-2011, 07:07 PM   #24
Matthew Swartz
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Re: The 405 Squat

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Originally Posted by Matt Haxmeier View Post
I assume you meant Threat, but it's probably even better this way. lol.
I literally just **** myself laughing at that. Totally meant threat. Treat is way funnier.
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Old 09-18-2011, 09:06 PM   #25
Chris Mason
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Re: The 405 Squat

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Originally Posted by Matthew Swartz View Post
I'm 5'9" on a tall day.

Left knee is feeling a little tweaky two days after this.
I'm not sure what was said in the rest of this thread, but your squat form is going to lead to knee issues. You need to sit back further on the descent. When you are at parallel your shins should be as close to perpendicular to the ground as possible (i.e. your knees should not be in front of your feet).
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Old 09-18-2011, 10:02 PM   #26
Matthew Swartz
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Re: The 405 Squat

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Originally Posted by Chris Mason View Post
I'm not sure what was said in the rest of this thread, but your squat form is going to lead to knee issues. You need to sit back further on the descent. When you are at parallel your shins should be as close to perpendicular to the ground as possible (i.e. your knees should not be in front of your feet).
Chris,

I try to pay attention to this as much as possible after listening to KStarr talk about destroying your knees from squatting with non-vertical shins. When I get into heavy loads like this, my chest always collapses and I shoot my knees forward to try to get back under the weight. I know exactly what you're talkin' about (and hence probably why my knee feels tweaky).

Thanks for the tip. I might be ordering some of your protein soon.
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Old 09-19-2011, 09:27 AM   #27
Chris Walls
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Re: The 405 Squat

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Originally Posted by Chris Mason View Post
I'm not sure what was said in the rest of this thread, but your squat form is going to lead to knee issues. You need to sit back further on the descent. When you are at parallel your shins should be as close to perpendicular to the ground as possible (i.e. your knees should not be in front of your feet).
What would you say about all the O-lifters who squat high bar with more of a forward knee position?
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Old 09-19-2011, 12:09 PM   #28
Matthew Swartz
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Re: The 405 Squat

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What would you say about all the O-lifters who squat high bar with more of a forward knee position?
I was under the impression that even in high bar lifting (all Oly as well) optimal squatting was done with vertical shins. Reduces the load on the Patelar tendon.
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:01 PM   #29
Chris Mason
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Re: The 405 Squat

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What would you say about all the O-lifters who squat high bar with more of a forward knee position?
1) They have built themselves up to it. You can train the body to accept a lot if you gradually and methodically build up to it.
2) They are blessed with respect to knee joint integrity. There are always people than can do things all "wrong" and suffer no ill consequences.
3) I don't have any statistics for knee problems when comparing O-style squatting and a seated back squatting style, but my guess is you would see a lot more issues with the former than the latter.
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:01 PM   #30
Steve Collegio
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Re: The 405 Squat

I'm pretty sure vertical shins is almost near impossible in a high bar squat.

Knees in front the toes is the optimal position in HBBS
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