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Old 11-28-2007, 02:26 PM   #11
Arden Cogar Jr.
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Absolutely correct. Druing the second pull, I need to get those shoulders in front of the bar and the bar closer to my body. I don't clean again until Sunday, but I'll make sure and post the link to my progress.

Thanks everyone.

All the best,
Arden

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Aguasca View Post
i noticed the same thing that Yoon pointed out, the bar position.

for example, during the multiple reps of hang power cleans, your shoulders were above or even behind the bar...you should lower the bar down the thighs by sticking your butt back...

WFS link of casey burgener transitioning:
http://mikesgym.org/wod/images/pullcasey.jpg

look at where his shoulders are, and look at where the bar is...
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Old 11-30-2007, 09:18 AM   #12
Yoon Sohn
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Hey Arden,
Regarding body/barbell positioning (keeping it close), check out Kendrick Farris' 2nd attempt C&J at 190, among others:

http://web.mac.com/kirkwood.wl/2006%...ge6/page6.html (work and family safe link to Oly vids)

The vids on this site are great because they're very easy to pause. Check out his positions...you'll notice that the bar actually makes contact with his legs at one point in the 2nd pull and stretches his singlet a bit.

Last edited by Yoon Sohn : 11-30-2007 at 09:22 AM.
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Old 11-30-2007, 09:37 AM   #13
Brandon Oto
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Very cool resource, Yoon. I'm used to doing frame-by-frame analysis to learn about form and I can't do that with YouTube.
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Old 11-30-2007, 01:28 PM   #14
Arden Cogar Jr.
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoon Sohn View Post
Hey Arden,
Regarding body/barbell positioning (keeping it close), check out Kendrick Farris' 2nd attempt C&J at 190, among others:

http://web.mac.com/kirkwood.wl/2006%...ge6/page6.html (work and family safe link to Oly vids)

The vids on this site are great because they're very easy to pause. Check out his positions...you'll notice that the bar actually makes contact with his legs at one point in the 2nd pull and stretches his singlet a bit.
wow!!! Stay close, shoulders in front of the bar, then drive up (almost back a little because of my thickness) with triple extension, then catch. I've always found his jerk a bit odd, but it works unreal. Not quite a power jerk, not quite a split jerk; something in between. Unreal athlete.

I have a long way to go. But I'm better now than I was 9 weeks ago, so I'm pleased nonetheless.

I've got a power clean session planned for Sunday. I just did power snatches/OHS amongst other things today with my little buddy (Mr. Pfister). I put the video on my log, but I'm going to stay focused on the cleans for now and work on them and I'll post the progress.

Thanks so much for everything.

All the best,
Arden
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Old 11-30-2007, 02:51 PM   #15
Joe Cavazos
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

If I may, again, link to my boy Pocket Hercules:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wVH0H0Dbpro (wfs)

It's a YouTube video, but it's slow and short enough that you can get some decent analysis out of it. It really demonstrates what the Clean and Jerk is all about. It's also a very ridiculous amount of weight.
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My WFS Log || Stats I'm least proud of: Max Muscle-ups: 1 | Max Push-ups: 38 | Max HSPU: 9 | 19" Vertical Leap | Max L-sit: 5 sec.
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Old 12-02-2007, 07:07 PM   #16
Arden Cogar Jr.
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

pocket hercules is out of this world....unreal.. thanks for the link.

Here's what I did today after my power snatches

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r_4Y0VZmvo

starts out with me doing my first sets of drop snatches ever with 95lbs. Man, I've got a long way to go.

Then after that I did 225x5 hpc - this was actually done after my work sets. For some reason when I posted the video, it got out of order.

My work sets went 135x2, 185x2 (recorded), 225x2 (recorded), 265x2 (recorded), 225x5 above, and 225x3 (recorded).

I don't think I'm driving my hips enough, but I think I'm getting the bar closer to my body after I get it above my knees.

I worked on getting my shoulders in front of the bar with the hpc, but I've still got a way to go. It's like I've got my weight on my heels and it needs to be on the middle of my feet. If that make any sense?

I'm all ears for those that are willing to put the time in posting anyway it could help improve my form.

Thanks in advance.

All the best,
Arden
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Old 12-02-2007, 07:49 PM   #17
Lincoln Brigham
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

You're swinging the bar badly when you do hang cleans. You're doing them more like a Continental than a hang clean. Watch the end of the bar take on a path that looks like a "C". Oddly enough you are a little better when going from the floor than from the hang. (Most people have a better second pull when they start from the hang than the floor.) I'd want to see more of a vertical jumping motion, less of a back swing. Jump vertically, bring the bar with you.

The Drop Snatch is not secure and solid, as you know. Do more of these; they'll help. Make sure you get into a full squat - bottom out even if you have to use less weight.

Elbows are not getting high enough on the power cleans. You can get away with that on power cleans but you'll pay for it on squat cleans and front squats.

From the floor on a least a couple of the lifts your shoulders were behind the bar instead of over/in front of the bar. See Rips video comments on deadlift start position in the "Exercise Examples" page.
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Old 12-03-2007, 06:52 AM   #18
Arden Cogar Jr.
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lincoln Brigham View Post
You're swinging the bar badly when you do hang cleans. You're doing them more like a Continental than a hang clean. Watch the end of the bar take on a path that looks like a "C". Oddly enough you are a little better when going from the floor than from the hang. (Most people have a better second pull when they start from the hang than the floor.) I'd want to see more of a vertical jumping motion, less of a back swing. Jump vertically, bring the bar with you.

The Drop Snatch is not secure and solid, as you know. Do more of these; they'll help. Make sure you get into a full squat - bottom out even if you have to use less weight.

Elbows are not getting high enough on the power cleans. You can get away with that on power cleans but you'll pay for it on squat cleans and front squats.

From the floor on a least a couple of the lifts your shoulders were behind the bar instead of over/in front of the bar. See Rips video comments on deadlift start position in the "Exercise Examples" page.
Lincoln,
Thanks so much.

On those Drop snatches - I'm going to start with a pressing snatch balance, then a heaving snatch balance then the snatch balance. I have a big fear of the third pull (pulling under) and I've got to lose it.

I'll really work hard on getting my chest ups and my arms straight at the top of that pull. More of a vertical jump.

I'm doing squat cleans tomorrow, so I'll tape them and try and put all of this together. I'm going to get those hang power cleans looking right if I have to three or four sets. I'm sticking with the 100 kilos for those hang power cleans because anything lighter than that doesn't cause my form to break down. It's a mental thing for me. I'm not kidding, one year ago, I could barely clean 225 even though I could deadlift well over three times that amount.

Thanks so much for taking the time. I see myself as a work in progress.

All the best,
Arden
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Old 12-03-2007, 12:03 PM   #19
Torbjörn Tapani
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

In this last video. The set second to last starting from the floor was the best. The second pull was with more upright torso and was looking good. The last set you went heavier and your bad form from the hang cleans came back. All those years deadlifting playing tricks with your mind when it gets heavy. You are trying to pull everything with your back when you need to be using those powerful legs. It works to a point for you because you are crazy strong but on a max load you will just dissipate power from your legs meant to act vertically on the bar. Torso more upright, use that drive from the legs.
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Old 12-03-2007, 12:49 PM   #20
Arden Cogar Jr.
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Re: Clean and Squat Clean - I've got a long way to go

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torbjörn Tapani View Post
In this last video. The set second to last starting from the floor was the best. The second pull was with more upright torso and was looking good. The last set you went heavier and your bad form from the hang cleans came back. All those years deadlifting playing tricks with your mind when it gets heavy. You are trying to pull everything with your back when you need to be using those powerful legs. It works to a point for you because you are crazy strong but on a max load you will just dissipate power from your legs meant to act vertically on the bar. Torso more upright, use that drive from the legs.

Gotcha!!!

Awesome advice and thanks so much. I sincerely appreciate it. For me, I'll have to find a way to get my legs involved. But you are absolutely right, when the weight gets past my knees, I'm all back.

That's where the vertical extension and driving the legs comes, correct? Also, I know I need to keep my shoulders and hips moving at the same rate/speed. I really need to work on that.

I'm so new to this, and I hope i'm not misquoting something.

Thanks again for everything.

All the best,
Arden
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