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Old 06-02-2015, 12:35 PM   #131
Jason A Smith
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Tim Alford View Post
I hope I'm not misquoting, but I believe he is referring to "if you want to be a better Crossfitter, than do more Crossfit". Rich's training is not hard to find if you do some research. No, I don't have his workout logs, but I've seen plenty of his videos and articles that highlight a typical day. He does metcons like the rest of us (although 4-5 in a day) and a significant amount of strength. Steven is just saying that it's not impossible to be as good as Froning without steroids if you are doing Crossfit workouts all the time. Just like Usain Bolt gets faster with his running, by.....running. Does that make sense? Because it does in my head.
Usain Bolt is gifted genetically. No matter how hard I try I will NEVER run as fast as him......EVER. Just like Rich has had the good fortune of being genetically gifted at his sport. He also works very hard, again, lots of people will work really hard they just don't have it, the way the world works I am afraid. Everyone has their gift, some people use it and others try to stuff themselves into something they are not.
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Old 06-02-2015, 04:57 PM   #132
Steven Wingo
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Struan Potter View Post
Blocks of GPP training have been used for decades long before CrossFit Santa Cruz opened.
True, quality core strength and conditioning programs were certainly used by some coaches and athletes in the past (even the distant past). Core strength and conditioning training was probably even better before the advent of Nautilus and subsequent machines in the "modern globo gym" era than it is during that still continuing but fading era. Greg Glassman in fact "invented" CrossFit by simply adopting and combining the best of what was being used out there across many disciplines of training (gymnastics, olympic lifting, power lifting, pushing and pulling sleds like they have done in football training for years, running, rowing, and so on.) So there were great coaches and athletes doing lots of things right. Failure to recognize that would be incredibly short sighted and naive.

But before CrossFit was there a clearly articulated, well defined training methodology that was made known to the general public and could be adopted by them and coaches and trainers wanting the best for the clients? No, there wasn't. Now there is--and it is allowing everyone from the highest level professional and olympic athletes in other sports, to CrossFit specific athletes, to your average 9 to 5 working stiff who just wants to stay healthy to attain levels of fitness they would not have previously reached before CrossFit and its prescription--constantly variable functional movements performed at high intensity--came onto the scene.

Back to the topic at hand of this thread--steroids. Why is CrossFit methodology so effective? One reason is that one of its primary goals is to elicit a natural neuroendocrine response through your workout. You are constantly shocking your body with short, very intense efforts which elicit such a response.

So maybe, just maybe, some of these athletes who appear superhuman--such as a 130 pound gorgeous woman overhead squatting almost twice her body weight--are just the product you get when you combine the right genetics with a relentless work ethic and what is a superior core strength and conditioning program. No pharmaceuticals needed.
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Old 06-04-2015, 06:11 PM   #133
Jon Campbell
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
I'm not sure how you can say Crossfit allows people to reach higher levels gains. I don't even know what that means. Better strength gains? Nope that still goes to powerlifters. Better size gains? Nope still goes to bodybuilders. Better sprint gains? Nah sprinters still have that. Endurance gains? Endurance athletes will rule that one too.

That isn't say that the methodology is inferior, it is not specific enough to ever be superior to those who are specialists. The whole point being, saying Crossfit allows you to reach higher levels of gains is completely lacking context. Not to mention, all Crossfit athletes train under some sort of Crossfit methodology so if we have two high level Crossfitters with equal genetics and work ethic and one uses PEDs then that one will no doubt be above and beyond better than their counterpart rendering the argument of its just Crossfits superior training methodology pointless.
Here's the problem...the best at all the disciplines you listed have either tested positive for PEDs or its common knowledge they are on the.
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Old 06-04-2015, 07:10 PM   #134
Luke Sirakos
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Here's the problem...the best at all the disciplines you listed have either tested positive for PEDs or its common knowledge they are on the.
How is that a problem? The best natural athletes in those disciplines would still wipe the floor with Crossfitters in that particular discipline. Changes nothing about the discussion.
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Old 06-05-2015, 03:58 AM   #135
Steven Wingo
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
How is that a problem? The best natural athletes in those disciplines would still wipe the floor with Crossfitters in that particular discipline. Changes nothing about the discussion.

What do those other sport athletes do for core strength and conditioning/cross training?

Surely they are doing core strengthening, something above and beyond just their chosen sport. What are they doing?

I'm willing to bet that if they aren't already doing CrossFit--performing constantly varied functional movements at high intensity--they could improve if they did so.
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:19 AM   #136
Luke Sirakos
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Steven Wingo View Post
What do those other sport athletes do for core strength and conditioning/cross training?

Surely they are doing core strengthening, something above and beyond just their chosen sport. What are they doing?

I'm willing to bet that if they aren't already doing CrossFit--performing constantly varied functional movements at high intensity--they could improve if they did so.
No.

Top level powerlifters, bodybuilders, sprinters, endurance athletes, etc (assumed natural for this) will not improve by adding CrossFit to their training. Athletes at this level need to train much smarter and doing CrossFit workouts would be wasting their energy when it could be put towards things that specifically help to attain their goals.
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:53 AM   #137
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
No.

Top level powerlifters, bodybuilders, sprinters, endurance athletes, etc (assumed natural for this) will not improve by adding CrossFit to their training. Athletes at this level need to train much smarter and doing CrossFit workouts would be wasting their energy when it could be put towards things that specifically help to attain their goals.
Agree.
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Old 06-05-2015, 08:04 AM   #138
Steven Wingo
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Luke Sirakos View Post
No.

Top level powerlifters, bodybuilders, sprinters, endurance athletes, etc (assumed natural for this) will not improve by adding CrossFit to their training. Athletes at this level need to train much smarter and doing CrossFit workouts would be wasting their energy when it could be put towards things that specifically help to attain their goals.
What "smarter" training should they do? Just add more swimming, riding, running, powerlifting, sprinting, etc. to their training regimen without incorporating core strength and conditioning?
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Old 06-05-2015, 08:39 AM   #139
Andrew Bell
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Steven Wingo View Post
What "smarter" training should they do? Just add more swimming, riding, running, powerlifting, sprinting, etc. to their training regimen without incorporating core strength and conditioning?
Yes, sport specific training. Do you think Michael Phelps needed to do crossfit to be better than he was the year he won all those medals?
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Old 06-05-2015, 09:19 AM   #140
Victor J McQuaide
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Re: Is Rich Froning the next Lance Armstrong?

Lance is a sociopath, I sure if killing people was his thing he would have had a big run. Even the best of them end up going back to the attention well one too many times.. Lance comeback 2009.. Clean... well not so much. I am sure that he tried. Lance was arrogant, an *** hole.... the list would go on... starting before he won the World Championships pre cancer.

Rich F.. he is a totally different guy. Everyone seems to like him. I have always said I would not be surprised one way of the other is he is doing something. I believe in Crossfit you can get away with what ever you wish to do.

In my sports career the people who looked un natural or too good to be true.. well you know the saying.

Even is Rich F was doing stuff he is not in the same caliper as Lance A... IMHO.
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