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Old 10-17-2009, 12:04 PM   #11
Doug Blankenship
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Robert D Taylor Jr View Post
The Hospital I work at has just banned children from visiting inpatients.
That doesn't surprise me at all.
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Old 10-22-2009, 09:31 AM   #12
Ian Kovtunovich
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Doug Blankenship View Post
That doesn't surprise me at all.
Lot of that going on around here, too. I just went in for my flu shot yesterday, and it's all mandatory hand sanitizer before heading back to the exam rooms, and they are giving masks to anyone with a cough. Huge neon-green poster in the waiting area about how to prevent the spread of flu. Docs aren't shaking hands, either.

The H1N1 is flying around like lies in election season.
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Old 10-22-2009, 11:06 AM   #13
Jamie J. Skibicki
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Re: skipping a vaccine

It must suck not having an immune system.
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Old 10-24-2009, 07:22 PM   #14
Jonathan Silverman
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Ian Kovtunovich View Post
....

The H1N1 is flying around like lies in election season.
the mortality rate of H1N1 is actually lower than the mortality rate of regular flu? did you know that?

Good line Ian.
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Old 10-25-2009, 08:30 AM   #15
Robert D Taylor Jr
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Jonathan Silverman View Post
the mortality rate of H1N1 is actually lower than the mortality rate of regular flu? did you know that?

Good line Ian.
But the folks it's killing shouldn't generally die from the flu. Younger healthy people.
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:23 PM   #16
Bart Hodlik
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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At my hospital you can refuse the "mandatory" flu shot. You have to sign a paper that basically says "yes, I've recieved education and I know I'm an idiot for refusing to get the flu shot, but I'm stubbornly refusing anyway".

Don't know if all hospitals are like that. Obviously if you're allergic to eggs or have had a previous reaction they won't give it, but lying about that just to get out of a shot is retarded.

but really, I'd just suck it up and get the shot. allergic reactions aside, there is zero scientific evidence that the flu vaccine has any negative effect on adults. Reports of vaccine reactions tend to be extremely misleading and rely heavily on scare tactics, hearsay, and pseudoscience.
Your statement of there being no side effects to flu shots is extremely ignorant of the vast amounts of data that DO show side effects. Ohhh not to mention that getting said flu vaccine only increases your chances of not getting the flu by about 2%. So then lets also talk about the adjuvants used in the vaccine. Or the mercury that is used quite often in vaccines.
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:28 PM   #17
Ian Smith
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Bart Hodlik View Post
Your statement of there being no side effects to flu shots is extremely ignorant of the vast amounts of data that DO show side effects. Ohhh not to mention that getting said flu vaccine only increases your chances of not getting the flu by about 2%. So then lets also talk about the adjuvants used in the vaccine. Or the mercury that is used quite often in vaccines.
I think he meant long term side effects, other than your short term immune response.

And thimerosal, the preservative that is partly composed of mercury, is only used in trace amounts. There are also single dose vaccines available that don't use it.

http://www.cdc.gov/FLU/ABOUT/QA/thimerosal.htm (wfs)
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Old 10-27-2009, 09:27 AM   #18
Jared Ashley
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Bart Hodlik View Post
Your statement of there being no side effects to flu shots is extremely ignorant of the vast amounts of data that DO show side effects. Ohhh not to mention that getting said flu vaccine only increases your chances of not getting the flu by about 2%. So then lets also talk about the adjuvants used in the vaccine. Or the mercury that is used quite often in vaccines.
you'll get more mercury eating fish. maybe not from 1 fish, but over a lifetime vs. a couple dozen vaccines...

more than 2% by something like an order of magnitude... but it's definately not a cure-all. I'm not the type that thinks everyone should go out and get a flu shot, but I also don't think there's any harm in it. H1N1 vaccine may be a different story, as it's live-attenuated vs. inactivated vaccine and obviously cannot have gone through adequate clinical trials in a period of a few months. I do NOT believe it has conclusively been proven safe (or unsafe)... there simply will not be sufficient data until this whole thing has passed.

be careful when reading about "data" saying there are side effects. For a research project recently, I picked up a few anti-vaccine books and was appalled at the misinformation presented as fact.

I remember one graph that claimed to show the percentage of children that had "serious" side effects to the "chicken pox" or varicella vaccine. The graph showed that 14% of children had a serious reaction (as in, had to go to the doctor). Later, buried in the text was the real information: really, it was 14% of children under 1 year of age, for whom problems had been reported. First off, only 3 in 100,000 vaccinations had resulted in a problem being reported, so the real number was 14% of 3 in 100,000, or 0.0000042%. Second, the vaccine was not recommended for children under 1 year, so the only way parents were getting vaccines for their months-old children was by lying about their age in order to take fewer trips to the doctor (absurd, but true... CDC website specifically raises this as a problem they have been trying to address). the numbers for children who had been vaccinated at the recommended age were about 3 times lower.

If you know how to research, the book didn't exactly lie, but they certainly used the data to misinform. most people would look at the graph and panic, then miss the details presented pages later.
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Old 10-29-2009, 05:17 AM   #19
Drake Deming
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Re: skipping a vaccine

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Originally Posted by Jared Ashley View Post
you'll get more mercury eating fish. maybe not from 1 fish, but over a lifetime vs. a couple dozen vaccines...

more than 2% by something like an order of magnitude... but it's definately not a cure-all. I'm not the type that thinks everyone should go out and get a flu shot, but I also don't think there's any harm in it. H1N1 vaccine may be a different story, as it's live-attenuated vs. inactivated vaccine and obviously cannot have gone through adequate clinical trials in a period of a few months. I do NOT believe it has conclusively been proven safe (or unsafe)... there simply will not be sufficient data until this whole thing has passed.

be careful when reading about "data" saying there are side effects. For a research project recently, I picked up a few anti-vaccine books and was appalled at the misinformation presented as fact.

I remember one graph that claimed to show the percentage of children that had "serious" side effects to the "chicken pox" or varicella vaccine. The graph showed that 14% of children had a serious reaction (as in, had to go to the doctor). Later, buried in the text was the real information: really, it was 14% of children under 1 year of age, for whom problems had been reported. First off, only 3 in 100,000 vaccinations had resulted in a problem being reported, so the real number was 14% of 3 in 100,000, or 0.0000042%. Second, the vaccine was not recommended for children under 1 year, so the only way parents were getting vaccines for their months-old children was by lying about their age in order to take fewer trips to the doctor (absurd, but true... CDC website specifically raises this as a problem they have been trying to address). the numbers for children who had been vaccinated at the recommended age were about 3 times lower.

If you know how to research, the book didn't exactly lie, but they certainly used the data to misinform. most people would look at the graph and panic, then miss the details presented pages later.
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Old 10-29-2009, 01:27 PM   #20
Jay Ticer
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Re: skipping a vaccine

Heh, I work as a consultant for a major medical center on the east coast, and got a lovenote from them stating that all contractors & consultants would have to show proof of vaccination, else be barred from the facility until they get vaccinated.

I'm peachy with the general principal (go science and all), but being dictated to when my business agreement with them has nothing in it about vaccines just bugs me.

Oh well.
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