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Old 06-02-2017, 02:38 PM   #181
Vic McQuaide
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

Im sure Benny will sort it out. Sure looking not so good right now. 42 points out of 5th not that bad. You will see many fall and him rise..
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Old 06-02-2017, 03:30 PM   #182
Ben Leeper
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

As many people of Reddit have mentioned, I just wish HQ would at least MENTION the injuries in event 2. Its almost silly that, as analyzers, shaun, Tommy, or Pat haven't even mentioned the increased possibility on event 2. I'm sure they were instructed not to. Somebody correct me if they have but I haven't heard.

The floor announcer saying, "Evans is...taking a rest..." when he came down from the rings after just a few reps was just cringe worthy. I know its not his job to talk about an injury as it is happening but it just makes me laugh at how much they avoid the issue.
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Old 06-02-2017, 04:08 PM   #183
Vic McQuaide
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

Ben Stoneberg is out now also. He was injured coming into the event they say. But he is another Games DNF.

Dave Castro was talking about event 2. Some people were pre injured, some got tears, some worse. He says part of the sport. He also says he would not change a thing except for peeps getting injured.

Bullet proof your shoulders folks.
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Old 06-02-2017, 05:16 PM   #184
Michael E Tancini
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

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Originally Posted by Vic McQuaide View Post
Bullet proof your shoulders folks.
This. We as athletes need to take responsibility for our mobility, stability, movement quality, and the injuries we suffer. There is nothing wrong with the programming or the ring dip movement.
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Old 06-02-2017, 05:47 PM   #185
Ben Leeper
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

Analyzers, commentators, and HQ acknowledging the injuries isn't them admitting guilt, it's them doing their job. Other than DC mentioning it as stated above, HQ has been silent which just looks bad on their part in the eyes of a lot of people.
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Old 06-03-2017, 12:00 PM   #186
Christopher Morris
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

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Originally Posted by Ben Leeper View Post
As many people of Reddit have mentioned, I just wish HQ would at least MENTION the injuries in event 2.
Dave Castro talks about event 2 injuries:

https://www.facebook.com/CrossFitGam...4429874598865/ (wfs)

His talking points:
- These injuries are unfortunate.
- Programming is not the cause. (Ring dips with these standards and rep scheme have been used in competition before without these injuries.)
- Do injuries expose a deficiency in training?
- 90-95% have no issue with this event.
- These are pec injuries (strain, tear). Not all injuries are pec tears.
- Competition CrossFit will have injuries because it is a competition where people push beyond their limit. Day-to-day CrossFit for non-competition athletes should not see these type of injuries.

My thoughts on his talking points:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2XusutYlsc (wfs)
Elizabeth (21-15-9 of cleans and ring dips) was done at the 2012 Games. It was event 13 of 15 events. No pec injuries there. Let's compare that to 2017 Regionals event 2.

Do 2012 ring dips look slower than 2017? Movement standards might be part of the problem. Though this movement standard hasn't changed, the range of motion / positioning should be re-evaluated. Maybe the way athletes have gotten bigger and faster each year has exposed current problems with a movement that wasn't a problem in the past.

The 2012 ring dips were the second event of the day after the double banger. Sledge hammer work engages the pecs and arms in a certain way.

The 2017 ring dips were paired with heavy DB snatch. This was after a weight vest event that included HSPU and pull-ups. This is going to load the pecs in a certain way. Was this loading too much for the pecs? Maybe it wasn't a problem with the programming of a single movement, but a problem with the bigger picture, which would include other movements, other events, and athlete preparation prior to Regionals.

Speed might be an issue in this sense: 2012 ring dips were event 13 of 15, so athletes would be more fatigued and moving slower. 2017 ring dips would have fresher, faster athletes, possibly more able to work to injury.

Personally, I think it is the DB snatch that is the major factor. A one-arm, heavy, asymmetric load. Notice how many of these injuries have the guys grabbing the right pec? I don't know if any have been grabbing a left pec, but it seems that right pec injuries have been more common. Does this point to asymmetric loading as being an issue? Right-handed athletes?

Still considering, speculating, discussing....
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Old 06-05-2017, 08:04 AM   #187
Christopher Morris
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

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Notice how many of these injuries have the guys grabbing the right pec? I don't know if any have been grabbing a left pec, but it seems that right pec injuries have been more common. Does this point to asymmetric loading as being an issue? Right-handed athletes
On right vs. left - I looked back at the barbellspin list of injured athletes (up to 34 now, including one female). Eight of the reported injuries specify right side injury, five specify left side injury. Attributing this to the asymmetric DB snatch is a leap. I can't imagine a scenario where both pecs would be injured simultaneously on the ring dips.
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Old 06-05-2017, 11:33 AM   #188
Vic McQuaide
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

way too many 33 men and 1 woman.. crazy thing..
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Old 06-07-2017, 02:17 AM   #189
Alex Burden
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

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way too many 33 men and 1 woman.. crazy thing..
That many Vic, you must be joking!!!!

Maybe it is not the actual event but the fact that the athletes bodies are wearing out due to the volume over such a long time.
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Old 06-07-2017, 08:32 AM   #190
Christopher Morris
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Re: 2017 CrossFit Open, Regionals and Games Thread

Theories on event 2 injuries that have been suggested:

- overtraining / volume fatigue / inadequate recovery
- insufficient warm-up
- deficiency of benchpress training / forward strength of pec (suggested by 2015 Barbell Shrugged video and by Dave Castro)
- mobility deficiency / motor control of shouler / internal rotation (suggested by Dr. Tancini)
- programming (heavy DB snatch paired with ring dips and/or event 1 leading to event 2)
- freshness / speed of athletes
- load / strength / mobility of men vs. women
- PED use increases risk of tendon injury

Which idea makes the most sense to you? Is it a combination of more than one of these factors?
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