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Old 10-26-2009, 08:44 AM   #1
Jim Denofa
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Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

So I used to compete in powerlifting about 10 years ago. I have always pulled sumo and am definetly stronger in that stance. My best sumo deadlift is 510, and my best conventional deadlift is 465. My question is this, why is the sumo stance not allowed in the CFT or in CrossFit Competitions? Squat stance's can vary with the individual and so can width of grip on any other movement, so why is the deadlift liimited to one style?
I understand the transfer from conv. deads to cleans and snatches and what have you while in training, but when it comes time to compete, I don't care about the transfer, I care about lifting more. Anyone else?
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Old 10-26-2009, 04:22 PM   #2
Jason Peacock
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

Because a sumo deadlift is distinctly not a deadlift, just as a push press is not a press. I can push press lots more than I press, but we're only measuring the press.

The goal is not to lift as much as possible via any means. The goal is to measure your progress in a single movement (deadlift, press, backsquat).
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:17 PM   #3
Jim Denofa
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

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Originally Posted by Jason Peacock View Post
Because a sumo deadlift is distinctly not a deadlift, just as a push press is not a press. I can push press lots more than I press, but we're only measuring the press.

The goal is not to lift as much as possible via any means. The goal is to measure your progress in a single movement (deadlift, press, backsquat).
So are you trying to say that sumo stance deadlifts are not deadlifts? Are you serious? By what standard? What constitutes a deadlift in a powerlifting competition? Which by the way is what the CrossFit total is designed to emulate. All of the rules that Rip states as the standard for squats and deads in the CFT are standards that all reputable PL federations abide by, aside from the rule of hands on the outside of the legs. Some of the best deadlifters of all time pulled Sumo. Ed Coan, and Wade Hooper off the top of my head. But then, there are others that pull conventional style: Bolton, Gant, Heisy, Henry, Konstanov etc. Pulling sumo does not make everyone lift more weght, it is the same as varying squat stance. All squat stances are legal in the CFT, so why the goofy rule about deadlifts stance?
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:35 PM   #4
Jason David
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

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Originally Posted by Jason Peacock View Post
Because a sumo deadlift is distinctly not a deadlift, just as a push press is not a press. I can push press lots more than I press, but we're only measuring the press.

The goal is not to lift as much as possible via any means. The goal is to measure your progress in a single movement (deadlift, press, backsquat).
Yeah..I think you're using a bad example here...

I started to sumo because it was easier to keep my back straight because of my short arms. I'm going to switch back and forth so I don't get tooo comfortable but...

I can either take Mark Rippetoe's advice and take myself out of the gene pool, or I can do sumo.

I was going to try it during the regional but decided against it.
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:39 PM   #5
Jason Peacock
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

I'm just saying that a "sumo deadlift" is not the same as a "deadlift". Heck, it even has a different name

I didn't make up the rules about the CFT, I just know that it's a "deadlift", not a "sumo deadlift." <shrug> Maybe some CFTs allow sumo style?

"all squat stances are legal" - this may be my inexperience in lifting, but what other squat stances are there? I"m not aware of a "sumo squat" or any other variations. There's variations in how you rack the bar (front squat, high bar back squat, low bar back squat, etc). But in all cases your legs are apart and toes are usually pointed outward at some angle, right?
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Old 10-26-2009, 06:52 PM   #6
Jason David
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

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Originally Posted by Jason Peacock View Post
I'm just saying that a "sumo deadlift" is not the same as a "deadlift". Heck, it even has a different name

I didn't make up the rules about the CFT, I just know that it's a "deadlift", not a "sumo deadlift." <shrug> Maybe some CFTs allow sumo style?

"all squat stances are legal" - this may be my inexperience in lifting, but what other squat stances are there? I"m not aware of a "sumo squat" or any other variations. There's variations in how you rack the bar (front squat, high bar back squat, low bar back squat, etc). But in all cases your legs are apart and toes are usually pointed outward at some angle, right?
You're missing his point. And he knows what kind of DL is allowed in the CFT. He's just wondering why?

What the heck about a sumo deadlift makes it not a deadlift anyway? You're picking something up with a slightly wider stance and your hands inside of your knees.
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Old 10-26-2009, 07:11 PM   #7
Jonathan Yoon
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

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"all squat stances are legal" - this may be my inexperience in lifting, but what other squat stances are there? I"m not aware of a "sumo squat" or any other variations.
There is a Sumo Squat and a host of other ones Here (WFS link) and there's also the zercher squat where you hold the barbell in your arms instead of using your hands and the hack squat where the bar is held behind you with your hands.

And just like the Sumo Deadlift, there are a bunch of other deadlifts too. The Zercher Deadlift scares the crap out of me.
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Old 10-26-2009, 07:18 PM   #8
Jason David
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

Too answer the OP's quesion though...as I was thinking about it - I would say that CF uses the conventional deadlift as a default for a few reasons...

1. Greater ROM
2. Easier to judge.
3. More people probably gain an advantage (lift more) doing sumo vs conventional (this is a guess).
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Old 10-26-2009, 08:28 PM   #9
Jason Peacock
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

I guess I have much more to learn

Jason's response makes sense - keeping things simple, which also supports only doing the back squat and strict press as well.
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Old 10-27-2009, 04:24 AM   #10
Anthony Bainbridge
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Re: Any other sumo deadlifters out there?

The only reason sumo deadlift is not allowed in the CFT is because Mark Rippetoe invented the CFT and he doesn't like sumo.

But the IPF (or any other official powerlifting federation) makes no distinction between sumo or conventional because it is not a guarantee that you can lift more with sumo. Some lifters are built for conventional, others are built for sumo. Most of the record holders are using conventional last time I checked.
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Last edited by Anthony Bainbridge; 10-27-2009 at 04:27 AM..
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