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Exercises Movements, technique & proper execution

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Old 03-05-2009, 02:37 PM   #31
Brian Lawyer
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Re: Squat Depth

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Originally Posted by Jason R O'Dell View Post
So, the "correct" way is to load it up on the tops of my shoulders ...
Low bar and High bar thing is so confusing, I know. There are tons of threads on the subject. What you just described above is a high bar position. Look at the picture Sean Dunston posted. That is a picture of a low bar back squat. The bar is held in position on a shelf across the scapula bones and kept in place by serious scapula retraction and lifting elbows to the back while keeping chest up.

High bar is what you described above where you just set the bar on top of your traps. To fully understand Rippatoe's Low bar squat methodology you really have to get the book. The starting strength squat is rip's own patented squat.

We can really go on all day about this. IMO, High bar back squat, O'Lift style is a lot less technique. Unrack the bar high on traps. The bar just sits there no big deal. You pretty much just sit straight down and back up. Forward knee travel is actually a good thing for a HBBS O'lift squat.

On the other hand with LBBS, you get into proper torso lean, knees should not travel forward, butt goes back, you have hip drive involved. I actually think it is bad to go to low so you have to be conscience of your depth. Reason I say this is because from reading the book, I understand as you hit that sweet spot where Hip crease = top knee, your glutes and hams are wound up like a rubber band to spring out of the bottom. Too low or Too high, you lose this tension coming out of the bottom.

Like I said, we can go on and on and on. We'll just confuse you more in the end.
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Old 03-05-2009, 02:58 PM   #32
Jason R O'Dell
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Re: Squat Depth

Well sounds like I do high bar squats and that was what my wife was trying to get me to keep straight. Does that not recruit your hamstrings and work your whole lower body?
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Old 03-05-2009, 03:11 PM   #33
Brian Lawyer
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Re: Squat Depth

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Originally Posted by Jason R O'Dell View Post
Well sounds like I do high bar squats and that was what my wife was trying to get me to keep straight. Does that not recruit your hamstrings and work your whole lower body?
Squats are a FULL BODY workout no matter how you do them. Some variations may just work your hams, glutes and low back a little harder.
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Old 03-05-2009, 04:55 PM   #34
Neil Fonseca
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Re: Squat Depth

Rip did not invent the "starting strength squat". It's just a correctly executed, low-bar, regular stance, full ROM squat. I'll try to describe low bar in the best way I can. If you pull your scapulas together hard, you can place the bar right above the rear delts (below the shoulder). So basically 2-3 inches below where you have it right now. If you place the bar there, you can sort of feel a shelf in your back where the bar just fits with no pain or discomfort. So just get under the bar and dig it into your back until it fits into place.

Don't try to guess the correct back angle by what is shown on the CF website. Your back angle will depend on your body proportions. It will naturally be the angle that places the center of mass over mid foot. So really, you should be thinking about getting your hips back, knees out towards the toes, and chest up. Your back angle will be correct if the knees go less than 1-2 inches in front of the toes. You really should get SS, as you will most likely continue to have problems until you do.
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Old 03-05-2009, 05:38 PM   #35
Brian Lawyer
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Re: Squat Depth

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Originally Posted by Neil Fonseca View Post
Rip did not invent the "starting strength squat".
I would have to politely disagree. Who ever heard of a "starting strength squat" before Rip wrote the book. There was no such thing as "starting strength". So how could there be a "starting strength" squat. Rip wrote the book, and now we have what is commonly referred to as the Starting Strength squat.

I am not referring to him inventing a power lifting squat or even a Low bar squat. But his technique has some unique characteristics which makes it the "starting strength" squat. He notes a couple things in his book about why he is a proponent of this technique such as due to his neutral shoulder width foot position and low bar that he feels this is the best squat for developing strength which can then be applied to any sport.

Perhaps Rip learned this exact style squat from someone else. But I am under the impression he pooled all his knowledge and experience together and came up with the style squat that he believes is best for strength. Then he wrote the book. Now we have the "Starting Strength" squat.
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Old 03-05-2009, 06:40 PM   #36
Neil Fonseca
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Re: Squat Depth

Please show us where Rippetoe claimed that he invented this radical new squat technique. He actually states in his book that none of the information he presents is new. I'm guessing that you haven't read the book, since you state that the "knees do not travel forward" in a low bar squat. As I stated before, the "starting strength squat" (you called it that, I was just quoting you) is just a plain old, regular low bar squat, which has been done for decades. Rip learned it from someone else. Not all powerlifters squat sumo style. They do have to break the point where the hip crease is parallel with the patella. Starting Strength is only ~4 years old anyway. How do you think people squatted before this?
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Old 03-05-2009, 06:44 PM   #37
Boris Bachmann
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Re: Squat Depth

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Originally Posted by Jason R O'Dell View Post
I'll throw in on this since I guess I don't understand bar positioning and depth.
Trying to be useful... Squat Rx #4: Bar Positioning & Depth (WFS) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eZ1HzoH0Rw
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Old 03-05-2009, 08:35 PM   #38
Jason R O'Dell
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Re: Squat Depth

Wow interesting debate up there.

Well I do high bar squats, so the method I was describing earlier where I just follow the bar straight down feels the best right now and seems to be the one I can do correctly. So I'll stick to it for now until I feel like it's not working or I want a different challenge then I'll move to low bar squats.
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Old 03-06-2009, 01:13 AM   #39
Steven Webster
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Re: Squat Depth

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Originally Posted by Neil Fonseca View Post
Rip did not invent the "starting strength squat". .
I hear Rip learned the low bar squat from Bill Starr.

While the starting strength squat seems to be in no-mans land in terms of it's application, it's definitely very good for casual trainees with no background in powerlifting or Olympic lifting.

It could be more suited to people with long limbs and shorter torso too.
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Old 03-06-2009, 06:33 AM   #40
Jason R O'Dell
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Re: Squat Depth

Ok sorry about earlier. I don't know what I was rambling about.

My wife told me that the photo from the cover of starting strength is what she was trying to get me to emulate. So I have no clue what exactly I was doing. But I could mimic that movement by following the bar straight down. So I guess I'll keep it up. Whatever works for ya right?
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