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Old 06-18-2006, 05:24 PM   #1
Matthew Nielsen
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Old 06-18-2006, 07:02 PM   #2
John Vernon
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Interesting stuff, pretty serious pictures. And yes, the bongo drum was comletely necessary.
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Old 06-18-2006, 08:30 PM   #3
Rob McBee
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I think the best knife defense is a bullet-based offense.
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Old 06-18-2006, 09:18 PM   #4
Dan Strametz
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Very serious stuff! More dangerous then a gun. Thanks for the clip.
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Old 06-19-2006, 08:40 AM   #5
Allan Talusan
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Great seen in Running Scared (no not the billy crystal flick!) where Paul Walker has to make a decision as to attacking a pimp with armed with only a switch blade while the pimp waves a .38 snubnose at walker and a little boy. Tuessler drill in the movies...
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Old 06-19-2006, 09:55 AM   #6
Kalen Meine
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They seem to be trumpeting the same "reality-based" cry that seems to have sprung up everwhere lately, but they don't seem to have got around to the point of making conclusions- understanding the nature of a scenario doesn't just render preparation impossible- it dictates the nature of the preparation. And sorry, I had a friend less than a month ago who was jumped by multiple attackers, one with a knife, and did he get cut? Yes. Did he also break his attacker's arm and run them off? Mmmhmmm. I have walking, living, breathing proof it's possible.

So what does the training need to look like to deal with the situation? Well, they seem to tout the fact that everyone did poorly against the suited, marking knife attacker as a sign of the impossibility of defense. I see that as a training avenue- sufficiently protected partners to use proper techniques in a strssful environment, and the ability to quantify how much you got cut up. It means training against tackles, charges, and the like, and being attacked at random intervals. Flinch training-ala Tony Blauer, and sensitivity training-so you have something of a sense of where the knife is in that "phone booth' where you're fighting- just like kali, wing chun, and the rest of the boys who regularly played with knives figured out. It means living by the SAS "rule of 2400"- if you haven't pulled it off at least that many times in training, it won't be one hundred percent reliable on the street. It means, just like Tuessler figured out, that LEO and others with guns need to deemphasize the use of their guns-or at least understand that in the most common scenarios, the lack of range and manipulation of the body holding it make it behave like another melee weapon. And just like the Dog Brothers have been saying for years- it means lots of training with weapons, very hard and very often, and understanding that knife encounters will always be terrible, terrible things, and what you are really doing is training to "die less often."
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Old 06-19-2006, 10:26 AM   #7
Jeff Gentry
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Hey Kalen

I agree with what your saying, I have a philosphy that if i am in a knife attack i will get cut, from what i can tell it is were and how deeply, training for a knife attack is good training and you should avoid getting cut/hit in training, the reality is that every situation is diffrent and you cannot train for all of them so do train as best you can for as many as you can and realize in a knife attack the chance's of you getting cut are very high and you can still "win".

In my book winning is surviving.

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Old 06-19-2006, 12:05 PM   #8
Dan Strametz
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Understanding that knife encounters will always be terrible, and what you are really doing is training to "die less often"

Great Quote Kalen.
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Old 06-19-2006, 01:16 PM   #9
Mark Dowst
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I bet the SAS only count drills that transfer 100% in thier 2400 number. The problem then remains the same, what drill/drills would transfer 100% and be safe enough to realisticly train. That has been the problem of every martial art since the begining and how they address that problem decides there real value.

The problem of a forced unarmed knife encounter is something that would require exceptional attributes that in my opinion has not been solved for the average or even above average person by any martial art. Alot are effective of minimizing risk, and that is the most we can hope for.

PS: I have limited knowledge on the subject and if you know something that in your eyes suggests otherwise please let me know. I am here to learn.
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Old 06-19-2006, 02:52 PM   #10
Barry Cooper
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I'm no expert on this. I have my opinions, but I think it prudent to keep them to myself.

However, I think the process of thinking is interesting. They put a bunch of cops--who don't look that seasoned, to me--through a scenario many of them fail. We know nothing about who these cops are, or what their experience is. We don't which, if any, of them study which martial arts.

From this, we progress to "martial arts fail if they stab a bunch of times." Which martial arts? Are they all equal? Does being the Polish kickboxing champion mean anything? Did he get stuck in the back? Was someone holding him?

If the cops had their guns out, and put double taps between his eyes, would the scenario have ended differently?

Knives are obviously dangerous. Anyone who pretends otherwise has never done skill drills with them, and seen how easy it is to poke someone. At the same time, how can you invalidate an entire CLASS of activity based on such a small data set? Obviously, you can't.

I know a number of people who have pulled knives off people on numerous occasions. It can obviously be done. I would hazard a guess most big-city bouncers have done it more than once.
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