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View Full Version : Jason Erickson's Kipping Pullups


Lynne Pitts
03-31-2006, 01:52 AM
Jason couldn't get this to post, and is looking for some feedback:

Joe Marsh
03-31-2006, 11:44 AM
Jason,

I'm no expert, but that's pretty much how my brother and I look when we do kippers. I'm hoping it's right! Maybe Eva or Coach will take a look.

Jason Erickson
03-31-2006, 11:58 PM
Lynne - Thanks for posting the clip for me!

I am looking for whatever constructive criticism I can get on my kipping pullup form. I feel there is more that can be done to improve it and make the movement more efficient.

Thanks in advance to all who reply.

Garrett Smith
04-01-2006, 02:47 PM
Jason,
Looks pretty good to me. Mine feel to me as if they would look similar (I think, I have trouble seeing them :happy: ).

Do you have any initial feelings upon performing and watching your kipping pullups as to where improvements might be made?

Personally, I'm really having trouble regaining my ability to quickly cycle the kipping pullups over a higher number of repetitions. I get done with two or three and I'm out of sync. It's not that I don't have the strength to link more together, I can knock off 8-10 L-pullups in a row when I'm fresh!

My initial feeling is that my hands are too close together, not allowing enough room for a smooth forward/back rocking motion at the bottom, as I'm really trying to push away from the bar at the top (maybe too much?). I'm also out of practice and deconditioned for kipping pullups, having subbed body rows for so long. At least now I'm subbing L-pullups, that still won't help my kip though...:sad:

Not trying to hijack the thread, guess I just felt it was a semi-appropriate place to think out loud. Maybe it will help someone anyway.

Dan Snyder
04-02-2006, 12:39 PM
Jason they look pretty good but I think you could get more power out of it if you pulled harder with your abs right at the top. It looks like your legs drop just as your chin is reaching the bar. That downward momentum seems to rob you of some power to get your head way above the bar. Does that make sense? I'm sure that there are folks who could explain it better. Just my .02

James Falkner
04-02-2006, 01:18 PM
I watched this again today. They are excellent kips. The only thing I see is that your knees are bent, which is probably 'cause the bar isn't mounted high enough (or you are too tall!). I find that when I am forced to bend my knees I can't get as much whipping motion on the bottom (just as a gymnast cannot swing as powerfully when the knees are forced closer to the core of the body, soemthing about centrifugal force and moment about a particular axis, I think I slept thru that part of high school physics).

Also, I think that as you get stronger and more able to maintain the kip, you don't need as much swing.

Jason Erickson
04-02-2006, 07:34 PM
Thanks for the feedback guys, I appreciate it! Most pullup bars I have access to are a bit low or too close to a wall, but I'll see what I can do to improve. I'm not great at high nonstop reps, but can do 6-8 sets of 5 reps.

I am focusing on some CST skill progressions now, but I like to work in some kippers here and there when I'm at work and don't have a client to train. Thanks to your suggestions, I will continue to refine the movement as my numbers go up.:proud:

Rene Renteria
04-03-2006, 11:36 AM
It looks like you’re not getting your hips high enough during the bottom (initial), swing-up part of the kip in the later reps. (Several of the reps look great.) That ab-dominant whip up to the top (the second part of the kip) will only extend your trunk as far as your hips allow (i.e., as far as your hips are high), so if your head is below the bar at the kip finish either your hips were too low or the movement was too slow overall, which makes you have that final pull to the top that looks like a dead-hang pullup finish on several of the reps.

The quickness of the second half of the kip, the part where you shoot your trunk with your abs, uses the inertia of your hips and lower body as a “base” to push against, sort-of. If it’s not fast, the upward momemtum of your body (generated by the hard, explosive pull at the bottom “to generate upward momentum on the [body]”) has time to stop as gravity reverses it and starts your lower body back down. So a “late” or “slow” kip will also accelerate your body downward, which can make you “miss” the top (the point above the bar where you were aiming your head).

During my own kips, as I tire, they slow down, my legs straighten more on the second half of the kip, and my head doesn’t get as high. The chain of events is that I don’t get that big upward momentum from a hard pull at the bottom, my hips aren’t as high, it takes longer to get them to their apex, and too much of the energy of the upper, second half of the kip goes into lowering my lower body instead of getting my upper body higher on a “still-rising” base (and shooting it hard and fast against this base to better use inertia).

Although I’ve divided it into two halves, it can (and should, I think) be one fluid motion, like a snake-strike. Check out Greg Amundsen’s kipping on the Fran video with Josh Everett on the FAQ page, and search for the video showing Annie Sakamoto and another woman ("Cylie", what was her name?, sorry I've forgotten!) doing 40 pullups for different ideas on kipping (super-powered vs. super-fluid).

As I understand it, this is similar to missing a clean from not having a full extension or one that is too slow to reverse (into the “drop under the bar” part) as you tire, which is why I think there is good carryover of the kip to the Olympic lifts. Except that instead of reversing to drop under a bar ("pulling yourself under"), you’re shooting your body to the top of the pullup (pulling yourself up).

Best,
Rene'

Anthony Papadopoulos
04-15-2006, 11:54 AM
Hey guys!! Help me out on this one.. I can hold a straddle planche, BUT i have bent arms.. So how is this one called? I think i got it on my second try ( there are a little balance issues involved). take a look. http://server4.pictiger.com/img/230514/picture-hosting/planche-1.php
There is no way i could straighten my arms out, though.
How i do this? Well, i squat down put my hands near my toes, and proceed to a tuch planche (with bent arms), and then find my balance and just straighten my legs out to a straddle.
Is that correct?

Lynne Pitts
04-15-2006, 01:46 PM
Moving to Digital Coaching...

Roger Harrell
04-17-2006, 09:47 AM
Start over at the tuck planch with straight arms. Bent arms and straight arms are totally different animals with the planche. It changes how the shoulder has to engage and dramatically increases the load. Once you get a solid tuck planch with straight arms you can do the same extension out to straddle.

Anthony Papadopoulos
04-17-2006, 11:49 AM
ROGER...thanx man for your time!
i see what you mean. it makes sense, since the lever is longer with straight arms... i ve recently started training the planche with straight arms (no paralletes), but with my fingers pointing towards my feet.. is this the correct way?

Roger Harrell
04-17-2006, 01:07 PM
However you can place your hands with stability and without trashing your wrists is the right way. When my planch was strong (in college) it was stronger with my fingertips pointing towards my feet as you are doing it, but a little more stable from a balance perspective with fingertips forward. Play with it both ways. Fingertips forward requires much greater wrist flexibility.

Anthony Papadopoulos
04-18-2006, 03:55 PM
But i think planches are EXTREMLY DIFFICULT destined for genetic freaks. do u agree?
i mean i can bench RAW (full rom of course), 1.7xBW, (i am 74 and bench 125kg), i can hold a back lever no prob, but wow planches are just out of the question. I mean i am not weak, but i find planches extremely hard. Maybe its the lack of parelletes?

Roger Harrell
04-18-2006, 04:19 PM
A solid legs together planch is pretty tough even within the world of high level gymnasts. Once you suggest it with someone who is 6' tall the numbers of folks that can pull it off is very small.

Pierre Auge
04-18-2006, 11:00 PM
YAY for being 5'5"!!!

Blair Robert Lowe
04-19-2006, 11:30 PM
I beat you. I'll call myself 5'2 in foot apparel but seeing as I'm barefoot most of the time I'm a bit under 5'1 but close enough.
Just as tall as the 11yo in my gym. Yeah. If it's any makeup at least I have longer ape arms my taller friends spout off.

(Message edited by Blairbob on April 20, 2006)

Jason Erickson
04-20-2006, 07:30 PM
I've continued to work on my kippers. Basically I fit in a set here and there at work when I'm in between training clients and the bar is available. My form has improved significantly as a result of experimenting with suggestions from this forum and elsewhere, and I'm up to doing sets of 13 clean ones before fatigue starts setting in. I drop to the floor without breathing hard... it's great advertising. :wink:

One additional thing (other than body mechanics) that has helped my numbers: I pause momentarily at the bottom. When I work them continuously, I get a bit of a swing forward at the bottom, and that seems to detract from the effectiveness of my kip. A brief pause enables me to kip from a better angle because my body isn't arcing forward at the same time. I will post an updated clip once I've grooved the improvements a bit further.

Rene - Thanks for the suggestions!:biggrin: I read them right after you posted them!

Peter Queen
04-22-2006, 05:49 PM
No wonder I have a hard time trying those. I'm 6'5"! :sad:

Roger Harrell
04-24-2006, 09:00 AM
Peter, when (notice I did say when) you get your planche you must get a photo with something in the background for scale. I don't think I've ever seen anyone at 6'5" get a legs together planch.